A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
For more on the aftermath of the shooting at Bondi Beach, we've called Rebecca Peters. She led the successful movement for gun reform in Australia after a mass shooting there in 1996 and has been thinking about what other policies the country may now consider. Rebecca, before we get to that, just lay out for us how difficult it is to get a gun in Australia right now.
REBECCA PETERS: Well, it's far more difficult than in most American states. You have to get a license, and that involves consideration of whether you're a fit and proper person. And there is - not all types of guns are available. We have a ban on rapid-fire weapons, and there's waiting periods and things like that. But this terrible tragedy has really highlighted some areas where the law still needs to be tightened.
MARTÍNEZ: Now, you also need a valid reason to own a gun, right? You just can't get one because you want one, or is it a little more complicated than that?
PETERS: Correct. That's right. So part of showing - of proving that you are a fit and proper person to have a gun means that you have to prove a valid reason. And I think that the question of a valid reason - there's valid reasons like, you know, hunting and sports shooting. And if you're a farmer, you have - many guns are on farms for protecting crops against kangaroos or wild boars or whatever. But the most common valid reason is said to be recreational hunting. And we think that that is probably far too widely being used as that's the easiest one to prove, and that seems to be the reason that was given by the owner of the guns in this case. So proving the valid reason is an area which has perhaps been too easily - it's sort of a loophole to get through.
MARTÍNEZ: Now, Rebecca, as I mentioned, you led efforts to create that policy in Australia. How did you wind up achieving that?
PETERS: Well, we had the good luck in Australia. We had a campaign that ran for many years of bringing together mental health groups, domestic violence groups, youth violence and youth suicide prevention, as well as police and trade unions, like, all the different aspects of Australian society that were affected by access to guns being too easy. We had a big grassroots campaign and based on the public health model of prevention. And it was the tragedy in 1996 at Port Arthur, which you mentioned earlier, which became the tipping point. And then what was extraordinary was that the two political parties - the main parties in Australia - agreed that this should be a nonpartisan issue. And so that removed the party political aspect from the discussion, and it became just much more easy to proceed on a rational discussion of what are the best policies.
And we were - at that time, our prime minister was from the Conservative Party in Australia, which was sort of unexpected that the Conservative Party would be the one that would take this decisive move. But actually, Conservatives or Progressives are just as committed as each other to preventing gun death and injury and trauma and crime. So the fact that we were able - the two political parties were able to come together and no longer weaponize this issue against each other was really important.
MARTÍNEZ: Now, despite Australia being recognized as having some of the world's strictest gun laws, Bondi Beach still happened. So, Rebecca, what more do you think is needed?
PETERS: Well, we need to take a much stricter approach to the business of approving licenses and also, as was mentioned by your reporter, the length of licenses. They range between three and 10 years. And over the period of 10 years, a lot of things can change in a person's life, and you may no longer be the person who was fit and proper in the first place. So those are a couple of the things that really need to be examined.
MARTÍNEZ: That is Rebecca Peters, who led Australia's gun control reform in the 1990s. Rebecca, thank you.
PETERS: Thank you.
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